Matt Scott

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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Rico on Mon Dec 07, 2015 11:10 am

Always need to keep in mind that some players might just want a change of scene (as we all do in our working lives sometimes), and will leave regardless of any money we might try and throw at the them and whatnot.

We definitely should try and persuade our key players (including Matt Scott) to stay but I don’t necessarily think we will have “failed” if some of them choose leave. That’s just life.

Look at DTH Van Der Merwe and Glasgow for instance. Doubt he’s on drastically better money in west Wales than in west Scotland, and he’s probably no more likely to win the Pro12/Champions Cup in his new home, but sometimes people aren’t solely motivated by money/titles.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby zt1903 on Mon Dec 07, 2015 12:23 pm

macdone wrote:
Friday Knight Lights wrote:When's duPreez SQ? Presumably he'll wait until then to leave, if he's looking to go. I think Nasi Manu and Bradbury will offset his (potential) loss though. Very impressed with Bradbury in the 7s I watched yesterday. Nel is irreplaceable and why he commands such a high price. I don't think Ben Toolis will leave because he's not an established international yet which is the shop window for Scottish players looking for big salaries.

On Scott if he leaves I hope he goes to a team like Glaws. They play some pretty good rugby at points which will suit Scott's best attributes.



We should ideally be keeping Nel and recruiting another top class tighthead so we can keep pressure on teams for 80 minutes. If we can keep our current pack and add recruit just one player (at tighthead) i will be delighted. But if we don't tie Nel up by the 6 nations and he plays well against England he is gone.


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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Tichtheid on Mon Dec 07, 2015 12:44 pm

Someone brought up a good point on another forum, presumably Solly wouldn't have extended his stay with Edinburgh without seeking some kind of assurances that these players' contracts will be extended? What would be the point of staying on if the one area of strength you have built is about to be disbanded?
Solly has also always spoken of Scott in the highest terms, he would expect him to stay on, surely?
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Weegie on Mon Dec 07, 2015 12:50 pm

Tichtheid wrote:Someone brought up a good point on another forum, presumably Solly wouldn't have extended his stay with Edinburgh without seeking some kind of assurances that these players' contracts will be extended? What would be the point of staying on if the one area of strength you have built is about to be disbanded?
Solly has also always spoken of Scott in the highest terms, he would expect him to stay on, surely?


He may want or expect contracts to be extended, the SRU may agree, but unless the players have signed the dotted line it means nothing.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Mon Dec 07, 2015 2:00 pm

Tichtheid wrote:Someone brought up a good point on another forum, presumably Solly wouldn't have extended his stay with Edinburgh without seeking some kind of assurances that these players' contracts will be extended? What would be the point of staying on if the one area of strength you have built is about to be disbanded?
Solly has also always spoken of Scott in the highest terms, he would expect him to stay on, surely?


A one year deal made me feel he'll be overseeing another transition period, neither side is committing a large chunk of their future to this deal. Either the SRU has someone lined up for 2017 and Solly is a stop gap or we want him to guide us through another large turnover of players in the summer and keeping him lessens the changes and therefore damage.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Tichtheid on Mon Dec 07, 2015 2:05 pm

Friday Knight Lights wrote:
A one year deal made me feel he'll be overseeing another transition period, neither side is committing a large chunk of their future to this deal. Either the SRU has someone lined up for 2017 and Solly is a stop gap or we want him to guide us through another large turnover of players in the summer and keeping him lessens the changes and therefore damage.



I was more thinking that at 65 years of age Solly probably doesn't want to commit to too long a contract, it won't be the climate that is keeping him in Edinburgh.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Oldsalt on Mon Dec 07, 2015 8:14 pm

If AS thought that much of Matt Scott why the heck did he play him at 13? That and his injury has stalled Matt's improvement for two seasons. Hopefully Verne Cotter will get Matt at 12 and Alex Dunbar at 13 fit for the 6 Nations. As others have said it is not always about the money. None of us know quite what Matt thought playing outside Strauss. Watching Tim Visser on the Aviva highlights show proves that I think, he's grinning like a Cheshire cat as he should as the Aviva top scorer. Sometimes you have to stand up for yourself like Greig did with RM.
However as we have seen with NDL,Viss, Grieg and Dent's if you don't like it then you leave so nothing can be discounted.
Winston Churchill said that going to sea was like going to prison but with a chance of drowning!
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Crichton Gunner on Mon Dec 07, 2015 8:37 pm

Rico wrote:Always need to keep in mind that some players might just want a change of scene (as we all do in our working lives sometimes), and will leave regardless of any money we might try and throw at the them and whatnot.

We definitely should try and persuade our key players (including Matt Scott) to stay but I don’t necessarily think we will have “failed” if some of them choose leave. That’s just life.

Look at DTH Van Der Merwe and Glasgow for instance. Doubt he’s on drastically better money in west Wales than in west Scotland, and he’s probably no more likely to win the Pro12/Champions Cup in his new home, but sometimes people aren’t solely motivated by money/titles.

Absolutely right Rico. I think a lot of people ignore this simple reality, preferring to blame Solly, the SRU, or whoever, as this suits their agenda. But let's be realistic, it's hardly surprising if a player who's been with us for several years, turning out in front of 3-4000 people inside Murrayfield, decides they may like to try something else before they reach the end of their careers. NDL, Greig, and Visser were all at the stage where they needed to move on, as they clearly needed a new challenge.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Mon Dec 07, 2015 9:07 pm

Tichtheid wrote:
Friday Knight Lights wrote:
A one year deal made me feel he'll be overseeing another transition period, neither side is committing a large chunk of their future to this deal. Either the SRU has someone lined up for 2017 and Solly is a stop gap or we want him to guide us through another large turnover of players in the summer and keeping him lessens the changes and therefore damage.



I was more thinking that at 65 years of age Solly probably doesn't want to commit to too long a contract, it won't be the climate that is keeping him in Edinburgh.


Yeah I think Solly's age is one factor in why he won't stick around. However I thought Solly was brought in to get the us off our knees and turn us into a respectable well drilled team. I see the SRU wanting to do a Lineen/Townsend with him and get him to take us as far as he can before getting a young coach (Scott perhaps) to take us further. I figured the one year deal is down to the fact we're not in a place to hire a younger coach and Solly will again have to rebuild once more with the contracts expiring before he hands over control.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Frenchy on Tue Dec 08, 2015 9:57 am

Oldsalt wrote:If AS thought that much of Matt Scott why the heck did he play him at 13? That and his injury has stalled Matt's improvement for two seasons. Hopefully Verne Cotter will get Matt at 12 and Alex Dunbar at 13 fit for the 6 Nations. As others have said it is not always about the money. None of us know quite what Matt thought playing outside Strauss. Watching Tim Visser on the Aviva highlights show proves that I think, he's grinning like a Cheshire cat as he should as the Aviva top scorer. Sometimes you have to stand up for yourself like Greig did with RM.
However as we have seen with NDL,Viss, Grieg and Dent's if you don't like it then you leave so nothing can be discounted.

Scott had been playing 13 long before Alan Solomons came on the go. He was also playing 12 in attack and 13 in defence. His injury has been the much larger issue than the number on his back.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby zt1903 on Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:07 am

Frenchy wrote:
Oldsalt wrote:If AS thought that much of Matt Scott why the heck did he play him at 13? That and his injury has stalled Matt's improvement for two seasons. Hopefully Verne Cotter will get Matt at 12 and Alex Dunbar at 13 fit for the 6 Nations. As others have said it is not always about the money. None of us know quite what Matt thought playing outside Strauss. Watching Tim Visser on the Aviva highlights show proves that I think, he's grinning like a Cheshire cat as he should as the Aviva top scorer. Sometimes you have to stand up for yourself like Greig did with RM.
However as we have seen with NDL,Viss, Grieg and Dent's if you don't like it then you leave so nothing can be discounted.

Scott had been playing 13 long before Alan Solomons came on the go. He was also playing 12 in attack and 13 in defence. His injury has been the much larger issue than the number on his back.


No he hadn't

Before Solomons came along we, fairly consistently, had Scott at 12 and De Luca at 13. Bradley gave him his debut in the first game of 2011/12 (against Cardiff) at 12 and almost never played him anywhere else.

Matt Scott never played 13 until ALAN SOLOMONS signed Andries Strauss which simultaneously moved one of our best players out of position and killed the creativity of our backline.

For comparison, our 23 from Scott's debut:

Traynor - Lawrie - Niven
Gilchrist - Turnbull
Cox - Denton - Grant

Laidlaw - Godman
Visser - Scott - Webster - Jones
Thompson

Subs: Kelly, Hislop, Gilding, Lozada, Watson, Leck, Hunter, Houston

Even bearing in mind that there was a RWC on and we were missing a few (Chunk, Ford, Cross, Rennie, Blair, De Luca, Paterson), that is keech. Quite a few starters that wouldn't make our bench today.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby dolf_lundgren on Tue Dec 08, 2015 12:41 pm

I think there is a lot of heat being given off from Scott being played at 13, apparently Scott leaving will be down to that? Do we really know that he hates playing there? Is Kinghorn going to leave because he is playing full back?

If anything Scott Playing 13 could make him a better all round player, he has the pace to do it so I don't see the problem. The problem is when we play Strauss at 12 alongside a learning 10, which kills the creativity. However we have seen this year that he is not first choice so only plays when he has to.

On the number of players being out of contract, it is only a theoretical problem at the moment, just because they are out of contract doesn't mean they will leave. Yes we have a lot of players out of contract but that is because 2/3 years ago out squad needed overhauled so these contracts are rolling round. Many of them will stay and I would bet that some have signed already but have not been announced.

On who will replace them, well I am a bit more sanguine, I didn't know much about Nel or Du Preez when they signed, hadn't heard of Toolis, Scott was pretty raw, so replacements may well come. I was gutted when Rennie left, but I am happy with the outcome of Watson and now Hardie. I know we need something to talk about but really a bit early to be panicking at the moment.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Frenchy on Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:10 pm

zt1903 wrote:No he hadn't

Matt Scott never played 13 until ALAN SOLOMONS signed Andries Strauss which simultaneously moved one of our best players out of position and killed the creativity of our backline.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Wsz0JoNdPM

Six months before Solomons arrived. Matt Scott at outside centre.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby Frenchy on Tue Dec 08, 2015 1:18 pm

In the 2012-2013 season, which is the season before Alan Solomons arrived, Matt Scott played twelve Pro12 matches for Edinburgh.

He played 12 five times, and 13 seven times.
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Re: Matt Scott

Postby dolf_lundgren on Tue Dec 08, 2015 2:13 pm

Frenchy wrote:In the 2012-2013 season, which is the season before Alan Solomons arrived, Matt Scott played twelve Pro12 matches for Edinburgh.

He played 12 five times, and 13 seven times.


Stop cheating, facts should never be used to win an argument on here! :lol:
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