1872 Cup Format

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1872 Cup Format

Postby Yonthing on Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:20 pm

Traditionally the 1872 Cup has been over two legs, winner decided on aggregate score.

The Warriors Announcment http://www.glasgowwarriors.org/news/17/08/01/important-information-season-ticket-members for the formation of the Pro14 confirms an extra game at the end of the season will form part of the 1872 Cup. So how is that going to work?

Highest points wins?
Winner of two games wins?

If one team wins two games but the other team scores more points in total, who wins?

I suspect this hasn’t been properly thought through. Perhaps the 1872 Cup should only be contested over the Christmas/New Year double header as before?
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Re: 1872 Cup Format

Postby dolf_lundgren on Tue Nov 14, 2017 5:26 pm

I would imagine it will be whoever winds most games. Would seem the logical way of doing it

Alternatively they could play the 2 league games at Myrseide/Scotstoun which are just for league points and the cup is played for at Murrayfield at Christmas, making it into a bigger occasion.

. Although the weedgies would moan abut that, it will be tough to find something they don't moan about though!
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Re: 1872 Cup Format

Postby Wottie on Wed Nov 15, 2017 1:02 pm

dolf_lundgren wrote:Alternatively they could play the 2 league games at Myrseide/Scotstoun which are just for league points and the cup is played for at Murrayfield at Christmas, making it into a bigger occasion.


All three games are of course league games but I would favour this single game format for the 1872 if we are to regularly play the Weeg three times a season under the Pro14 structure. Additional teams being added to the league may of course reverse this?

Have the 2 regular fixtures home and away over Xmas (let's face it, it's the holiday season and there is more then enough riding on them at this stage of the season with the derby spice thrown in, not sure the 1872 element is required). Then have the 1872 settled over the single game at the April fixture. This should be at BT Murrayfield and be accompanied with peripheral activities / family day etc. Maybe even have the Schools Cup Finals tied in on the same day? ER should play December home fixture at Myreside as our home ground under this arrangement, with MF a "neutral ground", which of course it now is. Would be a bit like the derby day the Welsh teams have at the Principality Stadium. This would be a great event towards the end of the season IMO.
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Re: 1872 Cup Format

Postby biffer on Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:09 pm

dolf_lundgren wrote:I would imagine it will be whoever winds most games. Would seem the logical way of doing it

Alternatively they could play the 2 league games at Myrseide/Scotstoun which are just for league points and the cup is played for at Murrayfield at Christmas, making it into a bigger occasion.

. Although the weedgies would moan abut that, it will be tough to find something they don't moan about though!


There will never be an Edinburgh Glasgow game at Myreside
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Re: 1872 Cup Format

Postby Edinburgh Shark on Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:29 pm

Murrayfield is the home of Scottish Rugby, all 1872 games should be held there!

*ducks for cover
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Re: 1872 Cup Format

Postby GaryIPA on Wed Nov 15, 2017 5:50 pm

Wottie wrote:
dolf_lundgren wrote:Alternatively they could play the 2 league games at Myrseide/Scotstoun which are just for league points and the cup is played for at Murrayfield at Christmas, making it into a bigger occasion.


All three games are of course league games but I would favour this single game format for the 1872 if we are to regularly play the Weeg three times a season under the Pro14 structure. Additional teams being added to the league may of course reverse this?

Have the 2 regular fixtures home and away over Xmas (let's face it, it's the holiday season and there is more then enough riding on them at this stage of the season with the derby spice thrown in, not sure the 1872 element is required). Then have the 1872 settled over the single game at the April fixture. This should be at BT Murrayfield and be accompanied with peripheral activities / family day etc. Maybe even have the Schools Cup Finals tied in on the same day? ER should play December home fixture at Myreside as our home ground under this arrangement, with MF a "neutral ground", which of course it now is. Would be a bit like the derby day the Welsh teams have at the Principality Stadium. This would be a great event towards the end of the season IMO.


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Re: 1872 Cup Format

Postby Wottie on Wed Nov 15, 2017 6:35 pm

biffer wrote:There will never be an Edinburgh Glasgow game at Myreside


I'm not a massive fan of the place, but why not? We were told that the capacity can be increased to 12k weren't we, and if Myreside isn't used, Scotstoun shouldn't be and we play them all at BT Murrayfield! :wink:
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Re: 1872 Cup Format

Postby The Feral Goat on Thu Nov 16, 2017 6:01 pm

I would like a Myreside and Scotstoun fixture plus the third at Murrayfield. The xmas game is always likely to be at Murrayfield to make the most of the crowd, too many folk back in the area for Christmas that may not be around at the end of season, makes sense for the clubs/SRU to cash in when they can.

From a selfish ER point of view I think, as a club in the rebuilding phase, we would really benefit from having this fixture at Myreside even at current max capacity of 5500-6000. I would like to think that by the end of the 3yr deal with Watsons we are selling out (or close to) most home game, but to get there we need to be winning, we almost certainly need to be in the champions cup and we need to make Myreside a hotter ticket. If we keep moving the “bigger” games to Murrayfield there will always be the supply to meet the demand and a number of supporters will continue to only attend these matches. However if they are at Myreside supply is limited and it may result in more ST sales, therefore more regular attendees plus more match day tickets bought in advance. Should we do well in Europe or the league and get to Quarter finals or playoffs it is of course sensible move to Murrayfield and capitalise on the one off event, but for me the core league and European group games should ideally be at Myreside.

However, in saying all that, like Biffer, I struggle to see the SRU giving up the additional revenue of two possible Murrayfield days, the only way I can see it changing is 1. Cockerill wants a match at Myreside and has the influence to have one moved or 2. There is a longer term view that the revenue generated from selling out Myreside regularly is greater than that of an additional one off at Murrayfield. While we are some distance form this at present this seasons largely positive results are a good start and a sellout match against Glasgow would be a good addition to the Myreside fixture list.
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Re: 1872 Cup Format

Postby biffer on Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:25 pm

The income from the extra crowd at Murrayfield v Myreside is the equivalent of a year of salary for a top class international player. I’d rather have the money to help hold on to our best guys and recruit good players.
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Re: 1872 Cup Format

Postby New Gunner on Thu Nov 16, 2017 10:39 pm

biffer wrote:The income from the extra crowd at Murrayfield v Myreside is the equivalent of a year of salary for a top class international player. I’d rather have the money to help hold on to our best guys and recruit good players.


Absolutely agree. Remember coming to my first Edinburgh game years ago with some friends, miserable experience with around 2000 fans in the soulless West Stand, terrible advert for Embra if this was the big derby match. With the increased interest in the national team and Glasgow, Edinburgh on the up, and the SRU marketing dept better than it was, we should be looking at 2 x 30,000-40,000 crowds, which could be worth Anything from £1m - £1.3m gross. With all of that going into Edinburgh's budget as the home team :lol: , I'd be delighted for the Weegies to insist on having their leg at 7,500 capacity Scotstoun.
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Re: 1872 Cup Format

Postby The Feral Goat on Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:06 am

I fully appreciate the money involved can’t be ignored, that the league may continue to evolve and the third derby game be a short term fixture so maybe correct to cash in now.

The flip side is if this third match exists for only a short period of time it is not a sustainable income stream, but if we can fill Myreside each match, so an extra 2500-3000 tickets sold over present levels, across the 11 games it amounts to almost the same.

The ideal has to be both selling out Myreside each week and packing 30,000+ into Murrayfield for the ER v Glasgow matches. We have seen from the likes of the Q final v the Dragons where there was 8000-9000 fans that there enough rugby fans out there to fill Myreside we need to get them coming each week rather than just once or twice a year. I believe having an ER v GW match at Myreside, as well as the other bigger matches, would help us towards increased crowds on a regular basis. Having this third fixture is an opportunity to do so although probably came about too late for this season.

We have started this season pretty well, relatively speaking, and assuming we continue to play well and pick up wins up to and through the 1872 fixtures it will be interesting to see if crowd numbers increase any in the New Year when Ulster and Leinster come over, I think our biggest crowd so far has been for the Ospreys on the Saturday evening but it was still under 4000.
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