Squad 19/20

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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby BigD163 on Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:05 am

Ayton1keith wrote:strong rumours of Faf De Klerk heading to Gloucesters next season, would Ben Vellacot be the perfect back up scrum half to HP


I came in to post this. The RP saying his contract ends this summer not sure if true.

His form has dipped but I'd be bringing him in to challenge and hopefully over take Pyrgos.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby bignose on Thu Dec 13, 2018 11:36 am

Have we written off Charlie Shiels then?
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby BigD163 on Thu Dec 13, 2018 12:09 pm

bignose wrote:Have we written off Charlie Shiels then?


No, we need 3 9's. Although it is concerning that Shiel can't get much of a look in. I would be getting rid of Fowles and Kennedy 1st.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby doedin on Thu Dec 13, 2018 12:23 pm

Hope not! I have only seen him briefly but reports I hear is that he is a cracking player in the mould of a Horne Jnr/Price. Word from Currie is they really rate him. I suspect that he is getting built up for the pro game and he will get his shot and 2nd choice to Pyrgos next year when either or both Kennedy and Fowles go - both have had a chance the last few seasons and neither have shown up. With Pyrgos and Shiels, and neither likely to be called into Scotland squads perhaps Vellacot might not be where we need to spend cash? I think we need another FB, winger and possibly a centre as a greater priority. Our lack of depth and quality has been exposed when Graham and Kinghorn have been called up and Scott, Hoyland and Bennet have been injured. Like Kennedy and Fowles the likes of Fife, Brown, Johnstone and Socino have been given a chance in recent weeks and haven't really shown they have what is required.

On a more worrying trend will the recent cash injection down south see a spike in interest in our big assets? The likes of Big Bill, VdM, Schoeman et al ,must be attracting a lot of interest down south. The coverage of our relative success in Champions Cup (so far) is good but it is letting them know we have some cracking players who would be relatively cheap in comparison, and probably more value, to the likes of ex ABs out for a quick pension fund payment.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Thu Dec 13, 2018 12:41 pm

Not too concerned about Schoeman and VdM leaving as both have Scotland aspirations. Mata will leave when his contract is up you'd think and fair plays he'll have earnt it.

Vellacott would be unlikely. He's in the England set up and they'll be looking for 3 9s next year. Young's, Care and Wigglesworth will presumably be out and he's gone an inside track being EPS.

Finlay Christie is more likely I reckon.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby biffer on Thu Dec 13, 2018 1:14 pm

bignose wrote:Have we written off Charlie Shiels then?


My assumption is he hasn't quite met some of the conditioning targets laid down for him. That'll come and then we'll see him.
Don't mention Rory Hutton. I did once but I think I got away with it.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby doedin on Thu Dec 13, 2018 1:32 pm

Friday Knight Lights wrote:Not too concerned about Schoeman and VdM leaving as both have Scotland aspirations. Mata will leave when his contract is up you'd think and fair plays he'll have earnt it.

Vellacott would be unlikely. He's in the England set up and they'll be looking for 3 9s next year. Young's, Care and Wigglesworth will presumably be out and he's gone an inside track being EPS.

Finlay Christie is more likely I reckon.


I would like to think the same re Shoeman and VdM but big money talks and with a £200m injection of cash some of the clubs down south will be desperate to spend it. Longer term I suspect this wont do the English clubs any good and may lead them to fall further into debt but then again logic doesn't seem to apply to their spending! I expect to see a flood of ex SH internationalists coming to mop up the cash on offer.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby Ayton1keith on Thu Dec 13, 2018 4:10 pm

Shiel has been in and around the squad (24th man) and appears to being managed the in the same way as Darcy Graham, his time will certainly come but we need someone to challenge HP now and IMO Vellacot would certainly fit the bill, he is a little more dynamic, with a good burst of speed and would bring another dimension to the team.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby New Gunner on Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:53 pm

Ayton1keith wrote:Shiel has been in and around the squad (24th man) and appears to being managed the in the same way as Darcy Graham, his time will certainly come but we need someone to challenge HP now and IMO Vellacot would certainly fit the bill, he is a little more dynamic, with a good burst of speed and would bring another dimension to the team.


I hope so, saw him for Currie last year and thought he was superb. Would make sense if he followed the Darcy path, so in the 23 next year. Cockers clearly rated him relative to others at his disposal in comments earlier in the year.

Vellacott? Would only come to Edinburgh if he felt he didn't have a hope with England, and also that he had a strong pathway to the Scottish team. He'd be behind Laidlaw, Horne, Price, Pyrgos, SHC? in the reckoning, with only one of those anywhere near retiring. Will he fancy being 4th / 5th in line for a 'lesser' national team while blowing his EQ earning potential? Doubt it - and sadly he's already indicated a preference for England despite his significant number of Scottish age grade caps.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby STKS on Fri Dec 14, 2018 4:08 pm

Was SHC on a one year or two year deal? Scarlet's going backwards and he seems to be falling out of favour there - not necessarily his fault, still early days. Genuinely think we'd be 2nd or 3rd in our conference at the moment if we still had SHC and Weir.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby gunner_graham on Fri Dec 14, 2018 8:08 pm

New Gunner wrote:
Ayton1keith wrote:Shiel has been in and around the squad (24th man) and appears to being managed the in the same way as Darcy Graham, his time will certainly come but we need someone to challenge HP now and IMO Vellacot would certainly fit the bill, he is a little more dynamic, with a good burst of speed and would bring another dimension to the team.


I hope so, saw him for Currie last year and thought he was superb. Would make sense if he followed the Darcy path, so in the 23 next year. Cockers clearly rated him relative to others at his disposal in comments earlier in the year.

Vellacott? Would only come to Edinburgh if he felt he didn't have a hope with England, and also that he had a strong pathway to the Scottish team. He'd be behind Laidlaw, Horne, Price, Pyrgos, SHC? in the reckoning, with only one of those anywhere near retiring. Will he fancy being 4th / 5th in line for a 'lesser' national team while blowing his EQ earning potential? Doubt it - and sadly he's already indicated a preference for England despite his significant number of Scottish age grade caps.


Maybe, but Vellacott's not even getting a sniff at Gloucester this season and he's a lot further down the pecking order than he would be here. I think he would be a good fit for Edinburgh as long as he has put his England ambitions behind him. If he can't get a start at his club or even on a bench slot, he's unlikely to be on Eddie Jones' masterplan.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby macdone on Fri Dec 14, 2018 10:11 pm

New Gunner wrote:
Ayton1keith wrote:Shiel has been in and around the squad (24th man) and appears to being managed the in the same way as Darcy Graham, his time will certainly come but we need someone to challenge HP now and IMO Vellacot would certainly fit the bill, he is a little more dynamic, with a good burst of speed and would bring another dimension to the team.


I hope so, saw him for Currie last year and thought he was superb. Would make sense if he followed the Darcy path, so in the 23 next year. Cockers clearly rated him relative to others at his disposal in comments earlier in the year.

Vellacott? Would only come to Edinburgh if he felt he didn't have a hope with England, and also that he had a strong pathway to the Scottish team. He'd be behind Laidlaw, Horne, Price, Pyrgos, SHC? in the reckoning, with only one of those anywhere near retiring. Will he fancy being 4th / 5th in line for a 'lesser' national team while blowing his EQ earning potential? Doubt it - and sadly he's already indicated a preference for England despite his significant number of Scottish age grade caps.


Could it be that box kicking is a big part of our game and he needs to develop that side of his game?

Looking down the age grades Jamie Dobie looks a great player.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby dolf_lundgren on Sat Dec 15, 2018 8:36 am

I think we can get a bit too excited about a bit a player because they are SQ, Vellacott has shown glimpses of quality but not a sustained period. He is 3rd choice at Gloucester so doubt he is anywhere near England.

At the moment he is similar to Jack Cuthbert was at Bath and we all got excited about him coming. Happy for Ben to prove me wrong and hopefully he will.
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby joe soap on Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:10 am

dolf_lundgren wrote:I think we can get a bit too excited about a bit a player because they are SQ, Vellacott has shown glimpses of quality but not a sustained period. He is 3rd choice at Gloucester so doubt he is anywhere near England.

At the moment he is similar to Jack Cuthbert was at Bath and we all got excited about him coming. Happy for Ben to prove me wrong and hopefully he will.


being behind Heinz who is excellent is not a sign of a bad player, being now well behind Braley as well is a problem for him, and I couldn't agree more about getting over excited because a player has a few cameos for an English team (and not sure many were actually league rather than LV cup games), mostly off the bench when its easier for a 9 to look good and up the pace.
Vellacott is nowhere near the England set up as you say, and it will be interesting to see whether he wants to stay at Gloucs and fight for a place, or thinks he needs to move, so I wouldn't be surprised if he came up here. Gloucs also have another SQ 9, last seasons U20 player, also a possibility I guess
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Re: Squad 19/20

Postby Weegie on Sun Dec 16, 2018 2:07 pm

Jake Kerr on the bench for Leicester. I am told after not getting a look in at Edinburgh and injury issues, he fell out of love with rugby went off to see the world, then came back to uni in England re-vitalised.

Astonishing how many of that generation went on to pro contracts.

https://www.scotsman.com/sport/rugby-un ... -1-4844604
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