Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby Tichtheid on Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:43 pm

Play all our backrowers and go for uncontested scrums from the start :-)
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby Pitfitter446 on Sat Feb 22, 2020 2:17 pm

Isn’t it great to be talking about who we could without? I too was a little worried at 20-14 but someone flicked a switch and the team dug in and responded, it was a good night to see it despite the weather.
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby gowrie on Sun Feb 23, 2020 11:43 am

Seeing both teams play this weekend, two things stood out:

Dobie is phenomenally good, and it really makes me more frustrated about how little faith has been shown in Shiel, maybe he'd mess up but at least give him the chance to show it especially when he shows glimpses of real magic in attack.

Winning and McQuillin came on and dominated the scrums, is this an indication that Super 6 has significantly stepped up the scrummaging level? Also the U20s have beasted their opposition there, very good news for us if true.
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Sun Feb 23, 2020 1:34 pm

gowrie wrote:Seeing both teams play this weekend, two things stood out:

Dobie is phenomenally good, and it really makes me more frustrated about how little faith has been shown in Shiel, maybe he'd mess up but at least give him the chance to show it especially when he shows glimpses of real magic in attack.

Winning and McQuillin came on and dominated the scrums, is this an indication that Super 6 has significantly stepped up the scrummaging level? Also the U20s have beasted their opposition there, very good news for us if true.


Dobie plays the way Rennie likes to play. He's an attacking 9 with a fast flat pass. Like Shiel. But we don't play that way. Shiel would be marshalling the pack to pick or one our carry and box kick territory. So I understand why Cockers isn't going with him but I do find Groom pretty average. The further we go this year the further I see Cockers going to his pack first game and running Pyrgos 65 minutes and Groom 15 weekly.

It's good for Scotland Dobie is with Rennie for now. I realise the Glasgow fans don't love Rennie but it concerns me Horne and Dobie are now going to be coached by Wilson who is forwards first. Let's hope they continue to develop.

The super 6 is definitely helping as the S&C is so much better so the players are bigger. That exposure means the jump for Winning and McQuillen isn't huge. Hard to read too much into the under20s as Thornton and Nicol were great but not yet found their feet at Glasgow.
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby The Nudger on Mon Feb 24, 2020 8:28 pm

I think the talent has always there with McQuillen but if I remember correctly there may have been a problem with his attitude while he was with Edinburgh...
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby Tichtheid on Mon Feb 24, 2020 10:06 pm

I’m watching it again now and I have to say I’m bilin, we have a totally dominant scrum which is getting penalised right left and centre and Connacht have just scored their second try, but the guy dropped the ball before landing on top it.

Water under the bridge? Aye it is, but there are points difference consequences, not to mention the clown car standard of refereeing in this league
Matt Scott’s try should have stood and the Connacht ten should not have been binned. I’m not there yet but the deliberate trip on Charlie Shiel was more of a penalty try than that.
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Tue Feb 25, 2020 9:58 am

Tichtheid wrote:I’m watching it again now and I have to say I’m bilin, we have a totally dominant scrum which is getting penalised right left and centre and Connacht have just scored their second try, but the guy dropped the ball before landing on top it.

Water under the bridge? Aye it is, but there are points difference consequences, not to mention the clown car standard of refereeing in this league
Matt Scott’s try should have stood and the Connacht ten should not have been binned. I’m not there yet but the deliberate trip on Charlie Shiel was more of a penalty try than that.


I didn't really think it was a penalty try - how else do you tackle someone diving to the ground? But my memory is a bit hazy. Scott should've passed to Bennett or HP.

The Connacht try knock on wasn't immediately obvious - does the tmo say anything unless asked to? I'm fine with it. Less TMO is good. I'm less fine if we don't win the game. But here we are.

I thought the Shiel trip was outrageous but not sure you could give a penalty try as he was a fair bit from the line.
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby Pitfitter446 on Tue Feb 25, 2020 11:20 am

Charlie may not have reached the line but the odds were stacked with him, should have been red minimum but ref bottled it maybe due to the score and time left on the clock, hoping for a similar performance from the team on Friday and hopefully better from the officials.
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby Tichtheid on Tue Feb 25, 2020 11:24 am

Groom rather than HP, I think Scott was entitled to go it alone, the proximity of defenders made any pass risky, in any event he grounded the ball legitimately according to everyone but the tmo, Bernard Jackman thought so too.
The seatbelt tackle is a penalty offence, during the review the tmo and ref have to decide if a try would have been scored if you take the offender out of the equation entirely, if so it is a penalty try and a yellow card, so in that respect they were correct, but I maintain Scott’s try was good anyway.

With the above in mind, you remove the Connacht player who tripped Shiel, look at the pace he was travelling at and what other defenders were around him. In my opinion Shiel would have scored, the closest defenders were a hooker and a flanker who had been on from the start and a winger who was chasing on the diagonal so had further to run, there is nothing in the laws about how far out the player is, it’s all about the likelihood of scoring.

We can’t control the ref, and his inconsistency at the scrum was infuriating, even in the light of the penalty try at the end, but their second try came from the fallout of Groom getting charged down, again.

Further to the scrum penalty try, McCallum, Fenton and Winning were rightfully ecstatic, Fenton is the oldest of that trio and he’s only 24, McCallum 23 and my guess is that Winning is at least a year younger than that.


An addendum, Matt Scott was with the other players in the “dugout” at the end and he looked chipper enough. Hopefully his substitution was precautionary
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby The Feral Goat on Tue Feb 25, 2020 11:59 am

Tichtheid wrote:Further to the scrum penalty try, McCallum, Fenton and Winning were rightfully ecstatic, Fenton is the oldest of that trio and he’s only 24, McCallum 23 and my guess is that Winning is at least a year younger than that.


Not just the front row, at the time we also had Hodgson (21) and Carmichael (24) in second row and Crosbie (22) in back row (Barclay and Haining take the average up a little)
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby robdinsdale on Tue Feb 25, 2020 12:08 pm

Tichtheid wrote:
With the above in mind, you remove the Connacht player who tripped Shiel, look at the pace he was travelling at and what other defenders were around him. In my opinion Shiel would have scored, the closest defenders were a hooker and a flanker who had been on from the start and a winger who was chasing on the diagonal so had further to run, there is nothing in the laws about how far out the player is, it’s all about the likelihood of scoring.



At that distance out it becomes too subjective, so I don't know about a penalty try, but given the way Shiel was breaking through, if that trip that wasn't cynical enough for a red card I don't know what is.
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby TheSmidge on Tue Feb 25, 2020 1:08 pm

Tichtheid wrote:The seatbelt tackle is a penalty offence, during the review the tmo and ref have to decide if a try would have been scored if you take the offender out of the equation entirely, if so it is a penalty try and a yellow card, so in that respect they were correct, but I maintain Scott’s try was good anyway.

a



Similar situation at Twickenham on Saturday for Henshaw’s try. He crossed the line with an English player hanging round his neck, but not even referred because the try was good. No prizes for guessing which English player was the offending party, especially when it is pointed out that it was the same player as should’ve been sin binned minutes earlier for hanging onto Stander...
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Tue Feb 25, 2020 1:25 pm

TheSmidge wrote:
Tichtheid wrote:The seatbelt tackle is a penalty offence, during the review the tmo and ref have to decide if a try would have been scored if you take the offender out of the equation entirely, if so it is a penalty try and a yellow card, so in that respect they were correct, but I maintain Scott’s try was good anyway.

a



Similar situation at Twickenham on Saturday for Henshaw’s try. He crossed the line with an English player hanging round his neck, but not even referred because the try was good. No prizes for guessing which English player was the offending party, especially when it is pointed out that it was the same player as should’ve been sin binned minutes earlier for hanging onto Stander...


But it's inevitable you seatbelt someone diving for the line. There's nothing else you can do? Apart from just let them score? I guess in the rules it's a seatbelt but so are all side on tackles when someone is diving for the line.

I'm not sure on the Scott try - I thought the rule was if carrying you have to have control which he didn't put a kick and it's just downward pressure which he had. So I get why that wasn't given and the PT was.

The tmo situation is a bit ridiculous. I think the tmo should give the ref two viewings and you decide from that. Or get a minute to decide. Think refs get paralysis by analysis.
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby Tichtheid on Tue Feb 25, 2020 2:52 pm

There's nothing in the laws about being in control of the ball in the act of scoring, only "pressing down on the ball" - hence you can score with your torso from waist to neck or with your arms.

It really annoys me when commentators mention "control" as it's not in the laws, likewise you can push the ball against the bottom of the post/pad and it's a score.

Scott never lost the ball forward, the Connacht player grabbed his right hand away from it and it went backwards and down his right arm before being grounded by Scott's left hand.
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Re: Edinburgh Vs Connacht Friday 21st

Postby Tichtheid on Tue Feb 25, 2020 3:06 pm

The Feral Goat wrote:
Tichtheid wrote:Further to the scrum penalty try, McCallum, Fenton and Winning were rightfully ecstatic, Fenton is the oldest of that trio and he’s only 24, McCallum 23 and my guess is that Winning is at least a year younger than that.


Not just the front row, at the time we also had Hodgson (21) and Carmichael (24) in second row and Crosbie (22) in back row (Barclay and Haining take the average up a little)



Good point - sub in Ritchie (23) and Bradbury (24) and that is a very young pack
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