Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Sat Mar 13, 2021 11:11 pm

Weegie wrote:
Tichtheid wrote:Move Charlie along the road and he'll be a star, I'd bet my last quid on it.


I know players in both squads who have played with Charlie. This is pretty much what they say.


Which is why signing Vellacott who is more Charlie Shiel than Henry Pyrgos to Edinburgh with a coach who refuses to play to their strengths is just silly from the SRU.
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby joe soap on Sat Mar 13, 2021 11:12 pm

Tichtheid wrote:
I don't think any of the three nines have been good this season, but only one offers a future.


I'd say that the first bit of that is true, and its true that age will catch the other two. Pyrgos and Groom are both proven top level 9s. Sheil a talent. Seems a bit of a coincidence is it not that all 3 go to SteveWalsh same season?
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby The Chiel on Sat Mar 13, 2021 11:20 pm

Recorded this and guess which sports channel gave the signal to stop recording with 75 minutes on the clock ? :angered: :angered: :angered:

Not sure whether to kick the TV or not when I saw the final score :lol: :lol:

Well done to Chamberlain - delighted for him.
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby Trophyhunter on Sun Mar 14, 2021 12:21 am

Good to see Chamberlain have a go off his instincts rather than the playbook and win the game . Fantastic!
Felt for Shiel a bit but still think he has it in him to be a more authoritative 9 . Dobie looks sharp , bright and full of potential .. but to be frank has yet to reach the levels of a Mike Blair or Cusiter. Flatters a bit at the moment .
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Sun Mar 14, 2021 12:40 am

Trophyhunter wrote:Good to see Chamberlain have a go off his instincts rather than the playbook and win the game . Fantastic!
Felt for Shiel a bit but still think he has it in him to be a more authoritative 9 . Dobie looks sharp , bright and full of potential .. but to be frank has yet to reach the levels of a Mike Blair or Cusiter. Flatters a bit at the moment .


A 19 year old hasn't reached the level of two British Lions and that's a legitimate criticism? Okay.
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby Trophyhunter on Sun Mar 14, 2021 1:11 am

Yep that’s ok. Spare the kid the hype and let him get there in in good time. Nurture his talent and manage his athletic development. As said bfr, Ritchie spent time on draft duty at Heriots , Blair at Boroughmuir , Russell at Stirling integrated with Pro experience
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:17 am

Trophyhunter wrote:Yep that’s ok. Spare the kid the hype and let him get there in in good time. Nurture his talent and manage his athletic development. As said bfr, Ritchie spent time on draft duty at Heriots , Blair at Boroughmuir , Russell at Stirling integrated with Pro experience


And Dobie doesn't need to play in a weak Scottish domestic game because he's already one of Glasgow's better Pro14 performers. We don't need to wait for him to become a good professional player as he's already there. Much like Blair Kinghorn who looked great for Edinburgh at 18/19. Hopefully both can progress into really great international players next.

I was thinking that Shiel would be better at Glasgow, the concern is does anyone think any of our backs wouldn't be better at Glasgow? It goes without saying Toonie and Rennie are better back play coaches than anyone we've had here. But if Wilson and Bell who certainly are not world renowned backs coaches and the talent drain they're seeing is still better we're in real trouble.
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby joe soap on Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:54 am

Trophyhunter wrote:Good to see Chamberlain have a go off his instincts rather than the playbook and win the game . Fantastic!
Felt for Shiel a bit but still think he has it in him to be a more authoritative 9 . Dobie looks sharp , bright and full of potential .. but to be frank has yet to reach the levels of a Mike Blair or Cusiter. Flatters a bit at the moment .


what a load of SteveWalsh. Did you think it up yourself or did Cockerill pay you to post that ?

Dobie is just 19, surprise surprise not up to Lions standard yet. He is starting for professional matches a couple of years younger than Blair or Cuister. And looks totally at home. He has had more chances this season due to injuries and tests taking Price and Horne out, but he has grabbed those chances. Contrast with Chamberlain who until last night was kept as an unused sub so often, then ball not passed to him when he did get on. And surprise surprise, we saw last night what might have been had he been given proper chances earlier.

As to Russell and Richie, again talking out of your KelvinDeaker. Richie played for Heriots a bit. As a 17 year old, same age as he made his Edinburgh debut. From 18 on he was pretty much a regular match day 23 with loads of starts.
Russell moved from Stirling (where he couldn't get a game) to play for Falkirk before he had any association with Glasgow, then to Ayr. By the ripe old age of 21 he had taken the Glasgow 10 shirt. At 22 won the league
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby Trophyhunter on Sun Mar 14, 2021 2:40 pm

On Kinghorn Stats will show that full backs have the least amount of contact in game. Ritchie was a a precocious physical specimen at a young age but had some lengthy injury spells along the way . Scrum half is a physically attritional position and the thrust of my point is to use teenage talent sparingly to give them space to grow physically and develop their game, make mistakes and push their boundaries.Also , to learn to organise their time and get on top of further education arrangements for life after Rugby . Chamberlain has just turned 21 and is now showing greater readiness for 1st team action than he did earlier in the season when he was looking so much more limited . Optimistic about him coming through iover he next 6 months.
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby disco on Sun Mar 14, 2021 11:24 pm

Trophyhunter wrote:On Kinghorn Stats will show that full backs have the least amount of contact in game. Ritchie was a a precocious physical specimen at a young age but had some lengthy injury spells along the way . Scrum half is a physically attritional position and the thrust of my point is to use teenage talent sparingly to give them space to grow physically and develop their game, make mistakes and push their boundaries.Also , to learn to organise their time and get on top of further education arrangements for life after Rugby . Chamberlain has just turned 21 and is now showing greater readiness for 1st team action than he did earlier in the season when he was looking so much more limited . Optimistic about him coming through iover he next 6 months.

Jonny Gray, Scott Cummings and both Fagersons were also first team regulars as teenagers in far more physically attritional positions than scrum half.
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby Tichtheid on Mon Mar 15, 2021 12:49 am

disco wrote:
Trophyhunter wrote:On Kinghorn Stats will show that full backs have the least amount of contact in game. Ritchie was a a precocious physical specimen at a young age but had some lengthy injury spells along the way . Scrum half is a physically attritional position and the thrust of my point is to use teenage talent sparingly to give them space to grow physically and develop their game, make mistakes and push their boundaries.Also , to learn to organise their time and get on top of further education arrangements for life after Rugby . Chamberlain has just turned 21 and is now showing greater readiness for 1st team action than he did earlier in the season when he was looking so much more limited . Optimistic about him coming through iover he next 6 months.

Jonny Gray, Scott Cummings and both Fagersons were also first team regulars as teenagers in far more physically attritional positions than scrum half.



I think "first team regulars" is pushing it a bit, Zander started five games in two seasons before he was twenty, which is of course still very young for a front row player.

Cummings also made five starts as a teenager.

Matt Fagerson made three starts at 19, before making himself a regular starter the following season at 20.

Jonny Gray is the one, he started the 16/17 season as a regular at 19, turned 20 after he'd already started seven games and continued to be the first choice in his postion.

All numbers are from itsrugby
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby robdinsdale on Mon Mar 15, 2021 7:48 am

Bit harsh writing off Charlie Shiel after that performance. Don't think he managed the conditions well but think all our 9s would have struggled with the obligatory box kicking routine in the first half.

I just noticed from the highlights how well Sau did with the offload for Chamberlain's try, on top of the good game he had before that.
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:07 am

robdinsdale wrote:Bit harsh writing off Charlie Shiel after that performance. Don't think he managed the conditions well but think all our 9s would have struggled with the obligatory box kicking routine in the first half.

I just noticed from the highlights how well Sau did with the offload for Chamberlain's try, on top of the good game he had before that.


I don't think anyone is writing off Shiel but questioning if he's going to live up to his potential in this current set up that places so much emphasis on 9 making decisions.

I hope Cockers starts him again next weekend. I guess VdW is starting for Scotland so should run out Shiel and Chamberlain again.
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby BigD163 on Mon Mar 15, 2021 10:29 am

Friday Knight Lights wrote:Exhibit a Nathan Chamberlain. Anyone think he's going to be left on the bench forevermore now? No chance!


Yes. In the very few games that matter remaining (not the Rainbow - the saffas need someone, anyone to play cup, or dead league rubbers) and VdW is available it will be back to status quo. There is nothing to suggest that the coaching staff will do otherwise.
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Re: Connacht v Edinburgh Sat 13th 1935 KO

Postby BigD163 on Mon Mar 15, 2021 10:40 am

Friday Knight Lights wrote:
robdinsdale wrote:Bit harsh writing off Charlie Shiel after that performance. Don't think he managed the conditions well but think all our 9s would have struggled with the obligatory box kicking routine in the first half.

I just noticed from the highlights how well Sau did with the offload for Chamberlain's try, on top of the good game he had before that.


I don't think anyone is writing off Shiel but questioning if he's going to live up to his potential in this current set up that places so much emphasis on 9 making decisions.

I hope Cockers starts him again next weekend. I guess VdW is starting for Scotland so should run out Shiel and Chamberlain again.


I don't think Shiel is the problem. I think is questionable whether many of our young guys can reach their potential under this coaching staff.
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