v Benetton away

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Re: v Benetton away

Postby BigD163 on Sat Oct 02, 2021 3:14 pm

gowrie wrote:
BigD163 wrote:Some pretty poor performances there. Game should have been sewn up long before the end.

Immelman was very poor today.

And for all the good work in the first half and good last penalty, the half backs lacked control in the game.


Have to agree on those, Immelman hasn't won me over the first few games. A good player in there no doubt, but give Moyano a shot for now.

On the halfbacks, definitely. Need to see more before you can be sure but maybe Kinghorn really is our first choice 10 this season. But can't let other guys off the hook either, it was the forwards who knocked on in the mauls and gave away the penalties near the end that kept the pressure on, nothing any halfback could do there.


Others need to take blame too but sneaking the win at the end hopefully wouldn't have masked the lack control from the spine of the team really.
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Sat Oct 02, 2021 3:27 pm

BigD163 wrote:
gowrie wrote:
BigD163 wrote:Some pretty poor performances there. Game should have been sewn up long before the end.

Immelman was very poor today.

And for all the good work in the first half and good last penalty, the half backs lacked control in the game.


Have to agree on those, Immelman hasn't won me over the first few games. A good player in there no doubt, but give Moyano a shot for now.

On the halfbacks, definitely. Need to see more before you can be sure but maybe Kinghorn really is our first choice 10 this season. But can't let other guys off the hook either, it was the forwards who knocked on in the mauls and gave away the penalties near the end that kept the pressure on, nothing any halfback could do there.


Others need to take blame too but sneaking the win at the end hopefully wouldn't have masked the lack control from the spine of the team really.


That's just Jaco for you - very very average. I thought Rambo was poor and so was Immelmann. I think Vellacott was very good but we needed to make a sub.

It's a learning game for Blair.
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby Weegie on Sat Oct 02, 2021 9:18 pm

Surely Duvenage was offside for their first try?

He came round behind the Edinburgh side of the ruck and was moving back to the Benneton side. The ball was kicked forward by a Benneton player and Duvenage picked it up in front of the player who kicked it.

Yes I now we should have won anyway, but still, it looks like an error by the officials.
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby Trophyhunter on Sat Oct 02, 2021 10:02 pm

Enough said about our game management and errors but reffing of game was weak and invariably gave the benefit of doubt to Home side.Jaco was struggling with a knock in last quarter so maybe should have been off earlier. Crosbie needs to do more than just exhort .
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby gowrie on Sat Oct 02, 2021 10:16 pm

Weegie wrote:Surely Duvenage was offside for their first try?

He came round behind the Edinburgh side of the ruck and was moving back to the Benneton side. The ball was kicked forward by a Benneton player and Duvenage picked it up in front of the player who kicked it.

Yes I now we should have won anyway, but still, it looks like an error by the officials.


Yeah, even without the kick he was in front of the back foot of Treviso so picked the ball up in an offside position.

We've faded late on in both games now, might be playing a game the team haven't had time to get conditioned for properly?
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby The Chiel on Sat Oct 02, 2021 10:48 pm

Really should have won that, regardless of any reffing. Error on error negating all the many positives about the approach to the game and trying to play rugby. Just need a bit of balance, which I would have expected JVDW to provide. Cockerill's head would have exploded.

Fair play to Benetton though - were also going for it, and showed how to manage the game at the end.
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby doedin on Sun Oct 03, 2021 10:03 am

Should have won but a combination of errors at the end lost us the game. Lineout should have been collected cleanly and ball recycled through a few phases and then kicked out. Just careless.

We are going to see a few more games like than this season until team finds the right balance and gets to know each other. We played well in parts but some decision making was poor at times. I understand wanting to get 50:22 kicks but unless it is definitely on then better to be safer and kick for distance.

Benetton will scare a few teams in Italy so 2 point return isn't a disaster given where we are at the moment.
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Sun Oct 03, 2021 11:45 am

Trophyhunter wrote:Enough said about our game management and errors but reffing of game was weak and invariably gave the benefit of doubt to Home side.Jaco was struggling with a knock in last quarter so maybe should have been off earlier. Crosbie needs to do more than just exhort .


Agree Crosbie's defence for their try was woeful. He's not had a good few years. If this continues we have to look at Muncaster getting his minutes. Or Kunavalu - when is he back?
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby djphilp on Sun Oct 03, 2021 2:23 pm

To be fair to Crosbie I don’t think he is the only one who burst onto the scene and has since gone quiet/not progressed as expected over the last couple of years under Cockerill.

What do people reckon is Crosbie’s best position? I don’t see him as a natural 7 personally and think he’d be better on the opposite flank, but maybe I’m just missing him doing the work on the floor because he is doing it well and never gets pinged?
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby Friday Knight Lights on Sun Oct 03, 2021 2:49 pm

djphilp wrote:To be fair to Crosbie I don’t think he is the only one who burst onto the scene and has since gone quiet/not progressed as expected over the last couple of years under Cockerill.

What do people reckon is Crosbie’s best position? I don’t see him as a natural 7 personally and think he’d be better on the opposite flank, but maybe I’m just missing him doing the work on the floor because he is doing it well and never gets pinged?


I think the problem is we just have way too many good backs rows so none of them ever get a run in the team. Crosbie was great under cockers when he got a few starts on the bounce and then when everything was stop start his form was poor. I think players such as Crosbie and Bradbury maybe even Boyle should be advised to leave for the good of their career. Look how well it's gone for Darge.
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby Trophyhunter on Sun Oct 03, 2021 10:25 pm

Just needs to work on carry and smarter distribution. He has the pace and talent , too much the limited bush basher at the moment
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby BigD163 on Mon Oct 04, 2021 10:24 am

Defence of a couple of players was pretty shocking. Rambo and Mata should have prevented their first try pretty easily.

That was the type of game the senior guys Rambo/Cherry, GG, Ritchie, Mata and Jaco all need to take a grip of and see out.
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Re: v Benetton away

Postby joe soap on Mon Oct 04, 2021 2:40 pm

Friday Knight Lights wrote:
djphilp wrote:To be fair to Crosbie I don’t think he is the only one who burst onto the scene and has since gone quiet/not progressed as expected over the last couple of years under Cockerill.

What do people reckon is Crosbie’s best position? I don’t see him as a natural 7 personally and think he’d be better on the opposite flank, but maybe I’m just missing him doing the work on the floor because he is doing it well and never gets pinged?


I think the problem is we just have way too many good backs rows so none of them ever get a run in the team. Crosbie was great under cockers when he got a few starts on the bounce and then when everything was stop start his form was poor. I think players such as Crosbie and Bradbury maybe even Boyle should be advised to leave for the good of their career. Look how well it's gone for Darge.


3 back rows, all potentially of the highest quality - Mata, Bradbury and Crosbie - all have their limitations in the way they have been used. All are best carrying in wide channels, room to get up some pace and break tackles. But can't really carry more than of them them in a starting 15 IMHO. They can all do the hard yards tight carrying, but they are neither among the best at that, nor is it best use of them. And like djphillip said, I don't think Crosbie is a natural 7. He is currently as trophyhunter said, being used as a limited basher. In a shirt with 7 on the back of it.

Cockerill gone, team need a total rethink on what they want of their back row, how to deliver that and who will give that balance. Just stockpiling like Cockerill did gets you nowhere
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